Hate Crimes vs. Thought Crimes

When I heard about H.R. 1955, I thought it was about hate crimes. I was wrong. It's about thought crimes. The latest anti-terrorism bill - presented by a Democrat, is H.R. 1955: Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act of 2007. I have always been against hate crimes laws and from what I'm reading so far, I think I am against H.R. 1955, which some are calling a "thought crimes" bill. But is it really about thought crimes?

Presently this bill does not create any new laws. What it does do is create a commission to do a study:

... Nowhere in there does it establish any criminal penalties or say that anything that falls within the definitions violate any criminal code of the US. What it does do is establish a commission to study things that the "commission" decides falls within those definitions and report back to congress those findings every 6 months with a final report due in 18 months. This bill does not "in essence" create thought crimes, but it does set up a commission to study them. It is not "the legislation" to implement them ... (more at Free Market News Network)

The bill is supposed to be about "preventing violent radicalization, homegrown terrorism, and ideologically based violence in the United States [and] is critical to combating domestic terrorism."

(b) Purpose- The purposes of the Commission are the following:

(1) Examine and report upon the facts and causes of violent radicalization, homegrown terrorism, and ideologically based violence in the United States, including United States connections to non-United States persons and networks, violent radicalization, homegrown terrorism, and ideologically based violence in prison, individual or lone wolf’ violent radicalization, homegrown terrorism, and ideologically based violence, and other faces of the phenomena of violent radicalization, homegrown terrorism, and ideologically based violence that the Commission considers important.

(2) Build upon and bring together the work of other entities and avoid unnecessary duplication, by reviewing the findings, conclusions, and recommendations of–

(A) the Center of Excellence established or designated under section 899D, and other academic work, as appropriate;

(B) Federal, State, local, or tribal studies of, reviews of, and experiences with violent radicalization, homegrown terrorism, and ideologically based violence; and

(C) foreign government studies of, reviews of, and experiences with violent radicalization, homegrown terrorism, and ideologically based violence.

Section 899D of the bill establishes a Center of Excellence for the Study of Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism in the United States. Essentially, this will be a Department of Homeland Security affiliated institution that will study and determine how to defeat thought criminals. (more)

Some say this violates our civil rights and goes against the Constitution.

This bill is one of the most blatant attacks against the Constitution yet and actually defines thought crimes as homegrown terrorism. If passed into law, it will also establish a commission and a Center of Excellence to study and defeat so called thought criminals. Unlike previous anti-terror legislation, this bill specifically targets the civilian population of the United States and uses vague language to define homegrown terrorism. Amazingly, 404 of our elected representatives from both the Democrat and Republican parties voted in favor of this bill. There is little doubt that this bill is specifically targeting the growing patriot community that is demanding the restoration of the Constitution. (more at roguegovernment)

With Hate crimes laws a criminal, whether he is guilty of murder, rape, whatever, is given a more severe punishment because the hate thoughts he/she had leading up to the crime. I think this is wrong. With HATE crimes laws:

While motive or state of mind are routinely considered in criminal cases (as mitigating or aggravating factors,) ideology is not routinely invoked in determining the seriousness of an alleged crime. Hate crime legislation, however, is expressly designed to punish particular thoughts or ideas.

Its advocates argue that hate crimes demand differential treatment because they are crimes against communities, not just individuals. Hate crimes "are more serious than a normal assault because they target not just an individual, but an entire group of people," [snip]

When someone convicted of assaulting one woman is subject to an enhanced prison sentence or a more vigorous prosecution because his assault was motivated by a hateful belief in the inherent inferiority of all women, then he is being punished for his thoughts as well as his conduct. (Wall Street Journal)

It seems that H.R. 1955 may have some very good intentions. With home grown terrorists, we want to catch them before they actually carry out a terror attack on American soil. But I don't believe anyone would be arrested for what someone in government thinks the individual has in his/her mind, without tangible material evidence to back up the charges.

What do you think about this bill?
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Comments

[W. Shedd]

It's a bad piece of legislation, even if it is only for the purposes of studying Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism.

One way to tell a bad law is to ask - do we already have laws that address violent acts and terrorism. The answer is yes, we arrest would-be terrorists and violent perpetrators already. Consider the arrest of 4 men this past year for attempting to blow up JFK's airports fuel depot and the FBI arrest of 7 black Muslim men in Miami who were reportedly discussing a terrorist plot. In both cases, arrests were made, the men were indicted, and they had NOT YET committed a violent terrorist act. So our current laws are working.

The law is bad also for the vagueness of the language. In essence, the law may eventually enable the government to cast a wider net to arrest and prosecute people for simply being angry with government policies.

Lastly, this law is basically a copy of an existing "extremism" law in Russia that has been widely criticized by the West, for many of the same reasons cited above.

You can read more about that law here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09/03/AR2007090300470.html

When Putin passes such a law, we call him a dictator. What are we if we follow in those footsteps?

[Debbie]

Thanks everybody for the comments. I'm still not sure what I think about this "committee". If it helps catch terrorists then I'm probably for it. But we need to be very careful when trying to legislate what someone might be thinking.

[DD2]

Good blog Deb.

I also did a blog on this subject last week.

[Rastaman]

I've ranted against the concept of hate crimes as actually being nothing but thought crimes enough that I don't need to do it again. What I find scarey about this is the idea of a "Center of Excellence for the Study of Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism in the United States". Center of Excellence? What?

Where in Hell did they come up with a name like that and more importantly, WHY? That's so similar to Orwells "Ministry of Truth", whose purpose was to spread propaganda lies, that it gives me chills.

"Center of Excellence". Hi. Center of Exellence here. We are wonderful here. We are excellent and beyond question here.

The name means absolutely NOTHING. It's SPIN! Sweet, gooey pap for the masses. Therefor it's not valid, not to be trusted and most likely one more attack on our Constitution and our freedom.

Hawai'i was great but it great to be back, too.

Rasta

[Grouch at Right Truth]

Sorry I posted the reply below in the wrong window.

[Grouch at Right Truth]

When I was a kid, I never missed Richard Boone starring as Paladin. Have gun, will travel.

Boy, that Richard Boone was one ugly dude!

[nanc]

i have the cure - give them one little shot of sodium pentothol before ANY questioning. BAM!

honestly - i'm not sure what to think of this bill - i do know, however, that MOST crimes have malice aforethought - very few are accidental...something to think about.

[michael]

What do I think of it?
I think that the nerve impulses in my skull are my own damn business, thank you very much.

What happens when those impulses reach my voice box or hand, that's everyone else's business.

Maybe.

[Angel]

the problem is Deb that the Mussslims are using all these laws against us..........all of them!:)

[Stormwarning]

And just what type of "thought" is this combatting? While I disagree with the Bill as I don't see how it can be implemented, could it be that it is legislating agsinst the very group you all love to hate? That ideologically based "religion of peace" y'all are always railing on against...the IMAMS standing there and preaching jihad.

[Skunkfeathers]

This is nothing more than yet another masked attempt from the Left to stifle conservative speech, by trying to brand it -- through a "commission" -- a "thought crime". Progressive effort at nothing short of "thought control".

Kill the bill.

[Wild Phil]

"Hate Crimes" That is the dumbest piece of legislation that there is, it's not a hate crime when a Church says that the act of Homosexuality is against the scriptures, it is more of a fact that the teaching says that we don't hate the individual but the act of the homosexual is what is wrong according to the scriptures.

When a person murders some one that is a hate crime if one wants a definition of Murder they don't murder you because they love you.

That is the whole problem with this Political Correctness scenario is that no one can tell anymore what is morally wrong and morally right.

They need to get rid of that ridiculous ruling.

It even states that in the Bible that, that is one of the signs of the coming END OF TIMES when "Wrong will look like right" and "Right will look like Wrong" when good will look like Evil and Evil like Good.

Be there forewarned that the far leftists will bring about THE END OF TIMES sooner than any other group.